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 Post subject: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:44 pm 
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I'm sure by now you're all read the story regarding Michael Sam.

I guess, I'm just getting put off by all these "announcements". To me I feel like if you choose to be gay, then cool. I nor anyone else has a heaven or hell to put you in. And the fact that we've come so far to the point where people now have to have press conferences to announce that they are gay is just compunding an issue.

Some folk hate what he did some folk loved it. Me? I cant say that I care either way. Do you what you do, man. I do hate that he may have cost himself a lot of money by disclosing his sexual orientation which has absolutely NOTHING to do with how he will perform on the field. It's a risk he decided to take, and that's on him.

You thoughts?

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 1:58 pm 
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What you do on your own time is your business, and as long as it doesn't interfere with what we're doing on the job, it should remain your business.

Funny thing is that most of the people who needed to know already knew.

Do I think it will have an adverse affect in his draft position? Absolutely.

From my understanding, the locker room is much different than just being in the showers at your local gym. Remember how much the NFL fought against women being in the locker room? They aren't going to fight this in public, but it'll definitely hurt him and the teams that will accept him and the publicity it will bring to the team.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:34 pm 
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If you're a gay human being, some folks are going to hate you for it. Some are going to be uncomfortable with you. Others are going to treat you the same way they treat any straight person. You can keep it to urself and deal with it one day as it's leaked or discovered as some kind of "scandal" or you can control your own message up front and let folks know right away who you are, giving those who have a problem with it an opportunity to let their ill-feelings towards you be known and move out of your life. If it causes you to miss out on SOME opportunities, then those opportunities weren't for you to begin with. Those opportunities were for who folks WANTED you to be and were yours as long as u are willing to sell yourself out for millions. This way, whatever opportunities are offered to you are based on who you are without holding your breath.

Millions? Gay? Millions? Gay?

Would be a strange "choice" if that were what it was.


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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:48 pm 
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impactology08 wrote:

I do hate that he may have cost himself a lot of money by disclosing his sexual orientation


Nope. This guy is a paparazzi spectacle. He WILL get drafted.

NFL may not want him, but the Networks and sponsors do.

Once NFL leaders get past their own prejudices, they will be able to see the revenue this guy will bring to any team. In about 10 years when all of his colleagues retire or leave from injury, you can expect reality shows and endorsements to still be rolling in for him.

I'm not sure what he can bring to the field, but I assure you he will bring a new target audience and more ticket sales.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:45 am 
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Still trying to figure out why being gay is big news.... everybody not straight....The end lol

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:40 am 
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Omatic wrote:
Still trying to figure out why being gay is big news...


He would be the first active NFL player to "come out." That, and the fact that the NFL is one of the most anti-gay atmospheres in America. Some people view this as a mile stone, some people view it as a sickness that finally infiltrated sacred ground.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 9:36 am 
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Randy wrote:
impactology08 wrote:

I do hate that he may have cost himself a lot of money by disclosing his sexual orientation



Once NFL leaders get past their own prejudices, they will be able to see the revenue this guy will bring to any team. In about 10 years when all of his colleagues retire or leave from injury, you can expect reality shows and endorsements to still be rolling in for him.

I'm not sure what he can bring to the field, but I assure you he will bring a new target audience and more ticket sales.



Maybe you dont watch the NFL....and maybe you do. But the guy is slated to go in the Mid 3rd-5th round that means he's already going into the league with a strong possibilty that he'll could be cut or be at the bottom of the depth chart. If he was projected to go maybe in rounds 1-3 then I'd see your point.

Secondly, GM's will look at Sam and maybe they'll want to draft him...but ultimately most probably wont because if by some chance they draft him and they cut then that GM and franchise will be known as "the franchise that cut the gay guy". No GM wants that pressue hanging over their head. Not too mention, the players in the locker room. You've got to consider the effect it will have on a locker room. Just because you dont hear players discussing how they feel about the situation doesnt mean, they are comfortable (or uncomfortable) with it. GM's know that.

These are reasons why I say he cost him self money. Look, he's gay. He'll always be gay. He'll be gay when he starts his career and will more than likely be gay when he ends it. Knowing that, put yourself in a position to capitalize on an opportunity that will take all it can from you. The NFL is an unforgiving sport and when it's all over it's just you and your medical bills. Be smart and shut your mouth until you've gotten paid because chances are you wont ever get an opportunity like this again. That's just me though...

Randy wrote:
Nope. This guy is a paparazzi spectacle. He WILL get drafted.

NFL may not want him, but the Networks and sponsors do.


See Tim Tebow. Arguably the most decorated and most prolific collegiate player to get drafted. 4 years in the league and barely started. Sponors and TV Networks dont make decisions for NFL front offices. If that were the case Tim Tebow would still be in the league because NOTHING was more popular than that guy for a bout to two or three year period.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:04 am 
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I guess I see both sides.

Personally, I don't need to know, and the rest of us really don't either.

On the flip side, I'm sure he's been gay since junior high or high school. As a star athlete who probably felt he needed to hide it, it probably has burned him up to keep it in for so long.

Bad thing is, the NFL can say all of the right things, but it absolutely is going to have a negative impact on his draft status. Just play ball, and let your personal life be exactly what it is - personal.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:24 pm 
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Steve,

You just touched on something: team chemistry. It's not always the person's talents or credentials that get them on a team or organization, it's (partly) how they will fit into the culture of the organization, as well. Now, I don't know how he's going to do in the NFL, but whatever team ends up drafting him will feel like he could fit in with the team's chemistry.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:48 pm 
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BW100 wrote:
Steve,

You just touched on something: team chemistry. It's not always the person's talents or credentials that get them on a team or organization, it's (partly) how they will fit into the culture of the organization, as well. Now, I don't know how he's going to do in the NFL, but whatever team ends up drafting him will feel like he could fit in with the team's chemistry.


And that's the thing. Chemstry, as cliche' as it sounds, "is everything" when it comes to team sports. So what GM will be brave enough to take the chance to draft a player that MIGHT hender locker room cohesiveness or may make one or two guys uncomfortable? I mean, all it takes is a for a star player to voice his displeasure with have Sam in the locker and that's it. That opportunity just went poof!

If it were me, knowing what I know. I wouldve just kept my mouth shut until after I got paid. I dont have am issue with him revealing his sexuality. That's his businesss. But he cost himself MILLIONS simply because of the timing of it all. He could have stilll made millions and still made a big reveal after he signed a contract and then proved it wouldnt be an issue. NOW he's got prove it's not an issue and in this case he may not even get a chance to even do that now. He better go ham at the NFL combine cause that's the only thing that's gonna help him.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 12, 2014 3:51 pm 
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Quote:
Maybe you dont watch the NFL....

Exactly.

I'm a fan of a losing NFL team, and I dont follow NCAA football, since my school does not have a football team. But I know who Michael Sam is. I first heard about him from my mom who hates football.

Tim Teebow is prolific in regards to NFL, FoxSports. His Christian/Conservative story creates something for sports analysts to talk about. Michael Sam is CNN, New York Times GQ/Logo prolific. He brings in an untapped target audience. (No pun intended..so many jokes I can make about this :lol: ) I suspect his new fans may not be your typical Monday Night Football viewers. Michael Sam was the cover story for my local news. This may just be the answer for those teams who are looking to increase ticket sales.


BW100 wrote:
Steve,

You just touched on something: team chemistry. It's not always the person's talents or credentials that get them on a team or organization, it's (partly) how they will fit into the culture of the organization, as well. Now, I don't know how he's going to do in the NFL, but whatever team ends up drafting him will feel like he could fit in with the team's chemistry.


That's what I was thinking. Something happened to where he knew this would eventually go public, or possibly some players already knew. Doing this is a form of disclosure.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Wed Feb 19, 2014 9:53 am 
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Everything is based on sexual orientation nowadays. Its crazy. I understand both sides.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 8:35 am 
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He's going to be in the NFL for a few years. When the press dies down, he will be released to do commercials with Tim Tebow.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Tue Feb 25, 2014 9:20 am 
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Miss_Band_Director wrote:
Everything is based on sexual orientation nowadays. Its crazy. I understand both sides.


Not everything. It's just that when the orientation is not considered the norm that there's an issue. Some parts of society just aren't ready (or willing) to embrace anything other than heterosexual orientation.

My pastor said it best when he said that it's crazy that people are praised for coming out, yet persecuted for being a Christian.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:17 am 
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There's a difference between this guy and Tebow not being in the league.

Tebow, for all intents and purposes, SUCKED. His mechanics were terrible, his play calling wasn't good, and he stayed eating the turf. I will give him credit for leading Denver to the playoffs, but that was mostly because the Denver D kept them at arms lengths in those games to allow him to get off one good final drive to win those games, which was mostly done with his feet, and not his arm.

This Michael Sam cat will only be playing on D, so he'll have a much less hand in deciding the outcome of games. So, the gay thing for him will be less of an issue once the season actually starts, just like how barely anyone cares about Jason Collins doing 9th (or 10th)-man duty on the rotation now that he's actually playing.

That's what this should be about. A guy who can play - and who probably will - at a professional level, who just so happens to be an openly gay player.

The focus on his orientation one of the the main reasons why sports journalism is more like TMZ these days. The most mundane stuff is out in the front. CAN HE PLAY IN THE NFL.....That's what the story should be.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 12:01 pm 
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BW100 wrote:
Miss_Band_Director wrote:
Everything is based on sexual orientation nowadays. Its crazy. I understand both sides.


Not everything. It's just that when the orientation is not considered the norm that there's an issue. Some parts of society just aren't ready (or willing) to embrace anything other than heterosexual orientation.

My pastor said it best when he said that it's crazy that people are praised for coming out, yet persecuted for being a Christian.

Christians are persecuted for their faith in this nation? I honestly find that hard to believe. Muslims, yes. Christians...not really.

I've never been persecuted for being Christian. In fact, an entire political party goes and above and beyond to "protect" Christianity in this nation.

However, throughout my teenage years and in college, I did fear being persecuted for being gay, hence the reason why I didn't "come out" until I graduated. When you fear your friends and family turning against you, and people damning you to hell from certain church pulpits ("certain" because this has changed a lot for the better), that feels more like persecution to me.


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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Thu Mar 13, 2014 12:45 pm 
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WildcatJay wrote:
BW100 wrote:
Miss_Band_Director wrote:
Everything is based on sexual orientation nowadays. Its crazy. I understand both sides.


Not everything. It's just that when the orientation is not considered the norm that there's an issue. Some parts of society just aren't ready (or willing) to embrace anything other than heterosexual orientation.

My pastor said it best when he said that it's crazy that people are praised for coming out, yet persecuted for being a Christian.

Christians are persecuted for their faith in this nation? I honestly find that hard to believe. Muslims, yes. Christians...not really.

That's because they aren't. It's some sort of defense mechanism.

The truth is, people come at Christians because the general public has simply gotten tired of the condescension that comes through their ranks that gets aimed at other people. Suddenly, we're all 'evil', 'wicked', and 'Hell bound' because our personal choices (which don't have a dayum thing to do which YOUR OWN life) don't reflect yours? Man, phuck that...and you.

You stick to what you believe and hold sacred, and keep it moving. Everyone else will do the same. This goes beyond religion, but it seems the Christian population tends to make everything in life about religion.

After awhile, people get sick of hearing it. Especially in a nation that was FOUNDED on the principles that people have the freedom to make their own choices.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:00 am 
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WildcatJay wrote:
BW100 wrote:
Miss_Band_Director wrote:
Everything is based on sexual orientation nowadays. Its crazy. I understand both sides.


Not everything. It's just that when the orientation is not considered the norm that there's an issue. Some parts of society just aren't ready (or willing) to embrace anything other than heterosexual orientation.

My pastor said it best when he said that it's crazy that people are praised for coming out, yet persecuted for being a Christian.

Christians are persecuted for their faith in this nation? I honestly find that hard to believe. Muslims, yes. Christians...not really.

I've never been persecuted for being Christian. In fact, an entire political party goes and above and beyond to "protect" Christianity in this nation.

However, throughout my teenage years and in college, I did fear being persecuted for being gay, hence the reason why I didn't "come out" until I graduated. When you fear your friends and family turning against you, and people damning you to hell from certain church pulpits ("certain" because this has changed a lot for the better), that feels more like persecution to me.


Perhaps persecution was a little harsh, but when you have people looked down at about their Christianity while others praised for coming out, it makes you wonder.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:24 am 
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Hurricane Mir wrote:
WildcatJay wrote:
[quote="BW100

Not everything. It's just that when the orientation is not considered the norm that there's an issue. Some parts of society just aren't ready (or willing) to embrace anything other than heterosexual orientation.

My pastor said it best when he said that it's crazy that people are praised for coming out, yet persecuted for being a Christian.

Christians are persecuted for their faith in this nation? I honestly find that hard to believe. Muslims, yes. Christians...not really.

That's because they aren't. It's some sort of defense mechanism.

The truth is, people come at Christians because the general public has simply gotten tired of the condescension that comes through their ranks that gets aimed at other people. Suddenly, we're all 'evil', 'wicked', and 'Hell bound' because our personal choices (which don't have a dayum thing to do which YOUR OWN life) don't reflect yours? Man, phuck that...and you.

You stick to what you believe and hold sacred, and keep it moving. Everyone else will do the same. This goes beyond religion, but it seems the Christian population tends to make everything in life about religion.

After awhile, people get sick of hearing it. Especially in a nation that was FOUNDED on the principles that people have the freedom to make their own choices.[/quote]


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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:15 am 
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Oppressed yes, persecuted no. I've met persecuted Christians.

It's fashionable to mock Christians and the essential message of Christianity hasn't changed in 2000+ years.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:46 am 
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BlackCalvinist wrote:
Oppressed yes, persecuted no. I've met persecuted Christians.

It's fashionable to mock Christians and the essential message of Christianity hasn't changed in 2000+ years.


+1

Hate the sin, not the sinner.... If he's good enough to get drafted, then good for him. I think that he'll make someone's roster if they need him, but he won't be anything groundbreaking... at least not in his early years.

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:28 am 
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DukeLOrange wrote:
BlackCalvinist wrote:
Oppressed yes, persecuted no. I've met persecuted Christians.

It's fashionable to mock Christians and the essential message of Christianity hasn't changed in 2000+ years.[/quote
+1

Hate the sin, not the sinner....



That's the thing. People blow my f'ing mind with their forced dogma. We don't all believe what you believe. Jesus is your lord. The Bible is your compass, but I have the right to choose mine. For that reason, this "hate the sin not the sinner" is no different than someone saying blacks should have all the rights afford by the Constitutions, but their still an inferior race.


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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:51 am 
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Okay truth be known, if you have ever been in a marching band you know someone that you think is gay or acknowledges that they are gay. And for us band heads, it's no big deal. What you do after band practice is your own darn business. But to the jocks, this is unheard of. Of course there were guys and gals on the various teams we though might have been gay but everyone kept quiet about it. They were okay as long as they stayed in the closet and didn't share their little secret with everyone.

I'm glad some college football player finally came out and announced they were gay...now the rest of the world can get on with their lives. In a few years Michael Sam will be a footnote on Wikipedia and no one (except die-hard racists) will care what an athlete does in the privacy of their own bedroom.


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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:53 am 
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SonicSound wrote:
DukeLOrange wrote:
BlackCalvinist wrote:
Oppressed yes, persecuted no. I've met persecuted Christians.

It's fashionable to mock Christians and the essential message of Christianity hasn't changed in 2000+ years.[/quote
+1

Hate the sin, not the sinner....



That's the thing. People blow my f'ing mind with their forced dogma. We don't all believe what you believe. Jesus is your lord. The Bible is your compass, but I have the right to choose mine. For that reason, this "hate the sin not the sinner" is no different than someone saying blacks should have all the rights afford by the Constitutions, but their still an inferior race.


So why should I accept your dogma (you have the right to chose your own compass) ? Why should I have your dogmatic position of keeping my faith to myself and in a closet somewhere other than in the public eye ?

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 Post subject: Re: Michael Sam: Coming out
PostPosted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:11 pm 
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BlackCalvinist wrote:

So why should I accept your dogma (you have the right to chose your own compass) ? Why should I have your dogmatic position of keeping my faith to myself and in a closet somewhere other than in the public eye ?


Wait. Who asked you to accept my dogma? Step away from the straw man. No one, I repeat no one is asking you to embrace my world outlook. I am, however, asking you to stop pretending as if everyone embraces yours.

The United States isn't a theocracy. Moreover, there is a reason why the founders believed in the separation of religion from the state -- when certain self-righteous people start justifying discrimination, disrespect, commendation, in addition to telling others who they have the right to love and boink ... in the name of the "lord" as if they speak for "god," let's just say things have gotten far, very far from what they should be.

And while I have you, If you truly believe Christians are being persecuted in the United States, I have a gang of Muslims I want you to meet.


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